Comments on: Science Friday: creation, pain, plastics, energy technology and disaster preparedness http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/ Schrodinger's tagline is both clever and banal at the same time Tue, 28 Aug 2012 20:56:43 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.5.1 By: WeeDram http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/#comment-4078 WeeDram Mon, 19 Nov 2007 03:06:22 +0000 http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/?p=1004#comment-4078 Lucas:  It’s not about logic for those who, emotionally, want to not accept responsibility.  It’s really easy to be an ostrich.  It’s just that when there is a whole world wide web available, one can create sites that mix pseudo-science with the sand in which one’s head is buried.

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By: Lucas http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/#comment-4077 Lucas Sun, 18 Nov 2007 21:12:23 +0000 http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/?p=1004#comment-4077 “The majority of scientist said the earth was flat and then that the sun orbited the earth. I am not saying the climate isn’t changing, it is always changing.”

Flat?  This is mostly a myth: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth_mythology

Indeed, a round earth is essential to Ptolemaic astronomy, a theory which was universally accepted for about 2000 years.  It wasn’t accepted because it seemed like a good idea, it was accepted because it was incredibly accurate—substantially more so than Copernicus’ theory was at the beginning.  How this frequently cited canard says anything bad about science continues to amaze me.  It’s as though you’re saying:

“Well, scientists used to believe a theory which was almost as accurate at making predictions as our current theory, but had the wrong underlying structure.  Our current theory is better.  Therefore, we shouldn’t listen to scientists.”

I don’t quite see the logic.

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By: george.w http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/#comment-4076 george.w Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:42:02 +0000 http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/?p=1004#comment-4076 Yes, everyone is aware that there have been huge climate swings due to natural causes, like comet impacts, mega-volcanoes (Yellowstone for one) and other reasons.  If one of those happens we’re totally screwed, game over and damn we’re out of quarters.  But why trigger one ourselves?  In another couple generations, we’ll even be able to prevent the other kind.  It would be ironic to screw it up now.

On a related note, does it bother you to speculate that the worlds’ scientists are in on some huge grant-money-driven conspiracy (an idea which makes every scientist I know double over with laughter) and then ignore the carbon-energy funding connection to the major “climate-skeptic” think-tanks and lobbying organizations?

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By: james old guy http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/#comment-4075 james old guy Sun, 18 Nov 2007 17:59:19 +0000 http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/?p=1004#comment-4075 I suggest you visit this site. http://www.longrangeweather.com/Long-Range-Weather-Trends.htm

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By: george.w http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/#comment-4074 george.w Sat, 17 Nov 2007 20:48:29 +0000 http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/?p=1004#comment-4074 Simply not true.  The ancient Greeks not only knew the world was round, they worked out its diameter to within reasonable accuracy.  Not bad since they lacked the instruments to derive the true structure of the solar system.  But the errors of church officials in the middle ages don’t have a lot to do with our present predicament. Other than providing a red herring for argument.

It is also not true that there’s any lack of data on global warming.  There’s lots of data, and even the super-religious Christy agrees that the data shows man is affecting the climate.  He is just not sure how much.  Or doesn’t want to be sure.

Of course, we could be really sure, if we’d launch the DSCOVR satellite to make real measurements of the Earth’s albedo from space.  The satellite is already built, can provide a real answer on the hottest issue of the day, and other nations have offered to launch it for us since the Bush administration has it socked away in a warehouse.  I can only conclude they don’t want to know.  and they don’t want anyone else to know, either.

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By: james old guy http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/#comment-4073 james old guy Sat, 17 Nov 2007 19:56:59 +0000 http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/?p=1004#comment-4073 The majority of scientist said the earth was flat and then that the sun orbited the earth. I am not saying the climate isn’t changing, it is always changing. How much man has to play in this global climate change has become and emotional issue with very little hard data to back up a lot of political issues. Its and easy card to play just like education,the actual data can be read a thousand different ways and bent to any point of view. The actual issue is how come up with a alternative energy source since the one we are currently using is a limited supply.

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By: george.w http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/#comment-4072 george.w Sat, 17 Nov 2007 19:20:42 +0000 http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/?p=1004#comment-4072 It would be very odd (and a bit suspicious) if a group that large did not contain a contrarian or two.  And while it is tempting to speculate that Christy’s odd background (how many former Baptist missionaries also have a PhD in atmospheric science?) affects his scientific judgment, it really just boils down to a question of “how much?”

Christy has said:

It is scientifically inconceivable that after changing forests into cities, turning millions of acres into irrigated farmland, putting massive quantities of soot and dust into the air, and putting extra greenhouse gases into the air, that the natural course of climate has not changed in some way.

His main disagreement with the rest of the panel is the question of how much certainty to attach to the predictions.  And here I feel pretty comfortable saying; “OK, here’s a scientist who agrees with the basic premise of his panel but says the expressed degree of certainty is too high.  We can’t afford to ignore the catastrophe that the other scientists predict.”

We should be showing leadership on a very likely threat instead of searching for loopholes with a microscope.  New technology is a good opportunity to get rich anyway. Carbon-burning is old and busted.

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By: Lucas http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/#comment-4071 Lucas Sat, 17 Nov 2007 19:01:22 +0000 http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/?p=1004#comment-4071 Creation museum—incredibly funny.

CO2 plastic – This sounds like it’s in no way a solution to global warming (in requires premade epoxides, which probably have a high carbon footprint), but it may reduce the cost of my polycarbonate lenses next time I get glasses.

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By: james old guy http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/#comment-4070 james old guy Sat, 17 Nov 2007 18:24:41 +0000 http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/?p=1004#comment-4070 It seems the IPPC has some members who do not share the same view.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7081331.stm

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By: WeeDram http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/2007/11/sci_fri_16nov07/#comment-4069 WeeDram Sat, 17 Nov 2007 05:02:46 +0000 http://www.decrepitoldfool.com/?p=1004#comment-4069 OK, those solar cells are too cool for words!  I sense this to be the breakthrough in PV cells that I’ve been anticipating … or at least a great first step.

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